Orange and Blue Hue » Examining the “SEC Phenomena”

Examining the “SEC Phenomena”

With two years like these, it’s bound to happen.

After Florida fans (and LSU, Georgia et al.) watched the pastings that the Gators and Tigers gave Ohio State, they saw the reputation of the Southeastern Conference validated on the BCS stage.

However, I want to look at some basic assumptions that fans of SEC schools have as a whole. Mark my words, this probably isn’t going to be the last post that I do on the subject.

Thought 1 - The best team from the best conference (the SEC champ) is a near-lock to win in ‘09

This has become a popular one. Over the past five seasons, SEC schools have bat 3-3 in BCS title game appearances. And Auburn went undefeated in 2004.

However, this argument isn’t as clear cut as most of us want it to. The Los Angeles Lakers won the top seed in the ultra-competitive West, swept a 50-win Denver team, and had their way with the Spurs and Jazz. To most casual NBA observers, LA was the best team in the best conference.

But as good as the Lakers were, the Celtics were better, even though they played in a conference where Detroit was considered the only other contender. Does the two-trick pony theme ring a bell?

And in the NFL, the New York Giants were not the “best” team in the best conference. In fact, they were a more middling squad in the NFC. But they still upended the perfect Patriots in the most-watched Super Bowl and the second most-watched TV episode in American media history.

The Pac-10 and ACC, generally considered the top two college basketball conferences by pundits, sent UCLA and North Carolina to the Final Four, but both lost. And the Memphis Tigers, a non-Big Six school, were several free throws away from their first national title.

As much as we want to believe otherwise, teams need to be evaluated on their individual merits. And using this logic, USC could be one of the teams that poses a threat to the SEC’s mini dynasty, particularly to Florida. The Trojans have talent at every position on the football field, and have enough tailbacks to make any run defense miserable. I wouldn’t pencil in Florida or Georgia just yet, but I like their chances this year.

Thought 2 - The SEC is the fastest conference in the FBS/Division 1-A

This one is popular. Very popular. Very, very, very popular. And, as much as I hate to say it, misguided.

As a whole, a number of SEC schools run spread offenses. Michigan is switching to a spread under Rich-Rod. Ohio State and USC still run a more conservative, pro-style game.

So are Florida and LSU really faster than the Buckeyes and Trojans? Maybe, but it certainly isn’t due to the way their athletes are used. If the Gators ran the option, and the Bucks the spread, who knows?

Besides, if the SEC really was a more athletic conference, it would certainly show up at the next level. The SEC kids should dominate the combine, the NFL draft, and take the league by storm, right? Wrong.

A quick glance of quarterbacks, running backs, and wide receivers (Where most of the offense, and hence quickness, is concentrated) in the first two rounds of this year’s draft show:

ACC: 1 (Matt Ryan, Boston College)

Big East:1 (Brian Brohm, Louisville)

Big Ten: 1 (Chad Henne, Michigan)

Big 12: 0

Pac-10: 0

SEC: 0

Other: 1 (Joe Flacco, Delaware)

ACC: 1 (Eddie Royal, Virginia Tech)

Big East: 1 (Donnie Avery, Houston)

Big Ten: 2 (Devin Thomas, Michigan State / James Hardy, Indiana)

Big 12: 2 (Jordy Nelson, Kansas State / Limas Sweed, Texas)

Pac-10: 1 (DeSean Jackson, California)

SEC: 0

Other: 2 (Jerome Simpson, Coastal Carolina / Dexter Jackson, Appalachian State)

ACC: 0

Big East: 1 (Ray Rice, Rutgers)

Big Ten:1 (Rashard Mendenhall, Illinois)

Big 12: 0

Pac-10: 1 (Jonathan Stewart, Oregon)

SEC: 2 (Darren McFadden, Arkansas / Felix Jones, Arkansas)

Other: 2 (Chris Johnson, East Carolina / Matt Forte, Tulane)

You read correctly. The only SEC offensive stars drafted in the top two rounds were the Razorbacks’ backfield. Don’t look now, but the Big Ten had the most selections with 5.

The NFL has a funny way of not discriminating based on school. Terrell Owens and Jerry Rice played at Division 1-AA schools, Randy Moss at C-USA Marshall. Giants receivers Plaxico Burress and Amani Toomer both played in the Big Ten.

Meanwhile, the Patriots employed no less than three SEC wide receivers (Donte Stallworth, Jabar Gaffney, Chad Jackson), an SEC tight end (Benjamin Watson), an SEC fullback (Heath Evans), and an SEC halfback (Kevin Faulk) And all those speedsters still couldn’t help New England go 19-0.

So were they really that much faster to begin with?

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I do not think the SEC speed argument is about the skill positions. Wide reciever, d-back, and running backs are all very speedy when you play at the highest level in college football. The speed deals with linebackers and defensive linemen particularly defensive ends. I do not know how you would analyze that but it seemed from the UF-tOSU game that their tackles/tight ends had no answer for the Florida speed rush

I agree that the “SEC Speed” myth is misguided at best. The recent LSU demolition of OSU was not done with speed. The Tigers dominated the line of scrimmage and beat the Buckeyes with a better gameplan. They were just plain the better team.

Not to take anything away from the SEC being a deep and balanced conference, but the speed myth is misguided.

Perhaps it’s deep-seeded guilt on the part of the BCS for shafting Auburn in 2004 that contributed to extra consideration being given to one-loss Florida and two-loss LSU in years hence?

I said it in 1992 that if an undefeated SEC team got left out of any MNC picture it would be a travesty. Never thought we’d be the poster child for it though…

Look on the bright side, though:

Over the past half decade, you’ve shamed one of the proudest programs in the SEC year after year after year.

Even rivals.com said something to the affect of, “National championship? Nick Saban needs to beat Auburn first!”

But all joking aside, I don’t think that the Tigers would have beaten USC anyway. The Trojans were just *too* talented in the Leinart/Bush years.

I have to take my hat off to you guys. Handing the national champs their only loss one year and canning the Tebow gang the next deserves respect.

Auburn has to be respected. I’ve always sort of liked Auburn, never felt they were a rival in league with LSU, Tennessee, etc. Their fans are gracious and well-behaved. That said, I’m really sick of losing to them!

Bo knows TP.

Florida and Georgia may be the best two teams in the country but Florida will have to follow Georgia’s lead in scheduling away OOC games to get more recognition nationally. Georgia finally saw that their ranking as the least traveled team in the least traveled conference was hurting their program. Your right the NFL’s better players still come from up north and home turf advantage still plays a major role in the illusion of any SEC phenomena.

Carl, Florida doesn’t need to travel to get national recognition. Have you already forgotten the massive UF lovefest that was our ESPN-televised-spring-game? We play on national broadcast television, and don’t have to worry about regions the way schools outside the SEC and Notre Dame do. They have regional contracts with ABC, but we can watch our games all over. I would like to see the Gators travel more, but it isn’t a requirement for national recognition.
In order for you to get credibility, show a little less kneejerk bias and back up your statements with facts and names. Then people might take you seriously.

Scheduling has nothing to do with it - if UGA had beaten S. Carolina OR Tennessee last season, they would have been playing in the BCS Championship. UF won in 2007 with our typical weak OOC schedule. Who did LSU play OOC last season?

That OOC stuff is reserved for the Big 10 where they only play 2 decent in conference opponents per year. The SEC has enough tough games in conference to quell that weak schedule perception.

I’ve said this a lot on here, but UF and UGA cannot (in a regular 11 game season) schedule a home and home series with a team from another power conference. It is because of the Jax game, both schools give up a home game every other year.

UGA scheduled Arizona St. this season because of the extra game. UF scheduled Miami.

I also think the speed argument is bunk, at least when you’re comparing SEC teams to top teams like Southern Cal, Ohio St, Michigan, etc. Those teams are all loaded with top talent at every position.

IMO, the difference between the leagues is in the depth of the conferences. The Big 10 has two elite teams, Ohio St and Michigan, two almost-elite teams, Wisconsin and Penn St, and a bunch of crappy teams. The Big 12 has elite teams in Texas and Oklahoma, a few almost-elite teams, and a bunch of crappy teams. The Pac-10 has one elite team, Southern Cal, and a bunch of middling teams, although I’m inclined to think their middle is stronger than the Big 10 or Big 12’s. The SEC, on the other hand, has elite teams in Florida, Georgia, LSU, and Auburn. Then, we have an almost-elite team in Tennessee. The league’s middling teams, Alabama, Arkansas, and South Carolina, have all had intermittent success over the past few years. Alabama is a former powerhouse, and could be poised for a return. Even the league’s bottom four, Ole Miss, Miss St, Kentucky, and Vandy, are capable of having decent years from time to time. Basically, the conference is so good top to bottom that on any given Saturday anyone can lose to anyone. Over the past few years we’ve seen Vanderbilt beat Tennessee and Georgia and come close to beating Florida. We’ve seen Kentucky beat Tennessee and Georgia. South Carolina has beaten Tennessee, Georgia, and Florida. The list goes on.

I think the overall conference depth in the SEC leads to a decided mental advantage for the conference champion. If you win the SEC, you’ve had to weather several close games throughout the season. If you win the Big 10, you’ve had to weather three or four. All this means that SEC teams have to learn how to execute week in and week out to win the conference, whereas a team like Ohio St gets used to being able to cruise. That difference in mental toughness, I think, has led to the outcomes of the last two championship games. Ohio St is loaded with talent and speed, but when their backs have been against the wall, they’ve folded because they’re not used to playing in close games.

I still say that Ohio St, Southern Cal, et al., have as much defensive speed as top SEC teams. The difference is in league depth. Miss St has more speed than Indiana; if that’s what you mean by the SEC having more speed, then I agree, but if you mean that LSU or Florida have decidely more speed than Ohio St or Southern Cal, then I’d have to disagree. League depth also explains the draft disparities; the SEC has more draft goldmines due to its high number of elite teams, plus the SEC’s lower-tier teams typically place a player or two in the NFL each year.

Anyone who saw USC, probably the fastest team in the nation, run circles around Illinois, one of the faster teams in the Big 10 in the Rose Bowl knows what effect team speed can have in a game.

The SEC IS the fastest conference. Just ask NFL scouts. Why do you think the SEC has more players drafted than any other conference? Is it a coincidence the SEC has more players on NFL rosters than other conferences.

Team speed isn’t based on your WRs or RBs but the rest of your team. And who thinks the quarterback is a speed position??? NOW that’s funny!!! SEC speed is largely on the defensive side. It’s a speed league, especially on defense.

Every fan wants to promote their own conference and, generally they do. SEC fans are more conference committed, meaning they have generally supported all the teams), while THE Big1(1)0 hate everyone!…they hate the SEC, they hate their rivals! Note that the Buckeyes have to STATE that they are “THE” Ohio State Univ…..like there was another one that was being mis-taken for them????
How many Bucknutts went CRAZY when Appt State beat Michy? ALL OF THEM?….nearly anyway.
I was watching that game with 9 Bucknutts and 2 Michy fans. As fly on the wall I asked the Bucknutts why this made them happy, knowing they have to play them…..43 curse words later, I still didn’t get their point. But I do now, its HATE. They hate everything but their own team.
As a UFlorida fan, I support Florida, then SEC teams -in that order.

Back to the arguents though. Now that all the World has heard Florida, Tenn, ‘Bammer, and the rest boast about thier conference being number one, others have taken up with it too. There are USCw fans saying the PAC10 is stronger than the the SEC, for example NOT that USCw is the best team, that their conference is stronger……Conference evny!??? Seems everyone is (STILL) following the SEC lead.

You cannot “just” look att his past Draft class and assume like you’ve done…..take the last 10 years! The SEC has nearly 140 ’starters” (or scheduled starters). That’s number one by far. The USCw conference, formerly know as the PAC10?…70!
Check the recruits,….SEC teams pulling them in, compared to the rest. Its not been close there either!
Back-to-Back Titles…and 4 BSC Titles. Twice as many as any other conference!
There are reasons people OUTSIDE the SEC say the things they do about the conference….and its got nothing to do with (conference) envy!

http://www.houmatoday.com/article/20080706/OPINION01/617509449/1103/sports&title=What_conferences_are_the_NFL_s_starters_coming_from_

…and “TEAM” speed means THE TEAM!,..not who’s WR is the fastest!

KG, according to an article on secsports.com:
http://www.secsports.com/index.php?s=&url_channel_id=2&url_article_id=6307&change_well_id=2

The number of players on 2007 opening day NFL rosters per conference looked like this:
1)SEC 263
2)ACC 238
3)Big10 234
4)Pac10 183
5)Big12 176
6)Big East 84

looks like the SEC is clearly destroying the other conferences right?
well at least until you take into account that not every conference has the same amount of teams to pool from…so let’s look at each conference’s per team average:
1)SEC 21.9
2)Big10 21.3
3)ACC 19.8
4)Pac10 18.3
5)Big12 14.7
6)Big East 9.3
That’s only 0.6 of a player difference with the over-rated Big10. What does this say….that every conference has it’s shitty teams…..and usually the more you add the thinner you spread recruiting which is 1 of the reasons Penn State has had such a drop off since joining the Big10 (the other being that JoePa needed to retire at least 5 years ago). The SEC obviously has the largest pool to recruit from….and sadly, if they were only a 10 conference team they would probably be producing Dynasties the likes of USC.

If there is a speed difference it is in the defensive line. This would also explain Southern school’s transition to more mobile quarterbacks.

The SEC has predominantly been known for smaller but quicker defensive linemen. Perhaps partially due to the weather in the southern US.

The fact that the SEC is on top with players is incredible when you realize that most of the current NFL players came from a down period (the mid to late 90s) in the SEC when outside of a couple of teams the conference we mediocre. A number of teams were on probation too. The current state of the SEC is far superior to what it was. The SEC has dominated the past two drafts when you consider the 1st rounders and overall numbers. Conferences will ebb and flow from year to year but with the current recruiting levels a lot of conferences will be fighting for 2nd place.

…”That’s only 0.6 of a player difference with the over-rated Big10. What does this say….”

No, that’s an AVERAGE of .6 ….that’s not .6 of “a” player!
AND, its still the SEC being #1!, THAT’S what it “says”.

Note: during the mid-to late 199’s, three seperate SEC teams won Football National Titles…..Most conferences would say that’s parity, or that’s three good programs (since Titles aren’t generally won over-night). The “meat” of those spanning 5+ years ALSO would make most conferences envious
PARTICULARY the BIG1(1)0 conference, where a to THAT point they’d not seen 3 Titles for quite some time….still haven’t, since 2002, 1997, and 1968 are NOT that closely related! (StatePenn won theirs as “inDEPENDS”…-an obvoious reference to Jo-”poopy”-Pa)
OSU owns the Big11, and USC owns the PAC10. Both are very good teams….The Winner of the September game is (almost) assured a spot in Miami…..but will get there by playing a comparably SOFT schedule….conf-wise.

Swampy, you beat me to the link.

Also, Gator fans:
In Florida, is Zook’s success at Illinois, combined with Meyer’s success with Zook’s players, considered support for the notion that the SEC is better than the Big 10?
My argument is that while the upper tiers of both conferences are very good, Kentucky, Ole Miss and Vandy would easily handle Northwestern or Minnesota.

i think the logic in your first point is probably not totally true.

you can not compare pros and college sports. ppl think sec champ has the greatest chance at NC-game coz it has better competetion till then.

but in pros most of the conferences have very good teams. so level of competition is not so different.

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